Changing Consumption Trends: Here's What to Know

Episode Transcript

Intro: [00:00:00] Welcome to the KayaCast, the podcast for cannabis businesses looking to launch, grow, and scale their operations.

Tommy: How well do you understand your customer? More importantly. Who's currently not a customer, but should be. Amanda from New Frontier Data joins us today to talk about consumer behavior data and how to tie insights into revenue. It was a great conversation. I hope you guys enjoy.

Amanda, thank you so much for joining us today.

Amanda: That was my pleasure. Thank you so much for inviting me.

Tommy: New Frontier Data has been a leader in consumer data since 2015. What are some of the differences that you've seen in consumer behavior between emerging markets versus mature markets?

Amanda: Well, that's a great question. You know, a lot of folks like myself started consuming cannabis when it was not legal and let's face it. Our product choices were few and far between. You basically [00:01:00] had one type of cannabis that your guy or gal was bringing to you and the one type way to consume it was smoking it. And so I think one of the biggest differences we've seen just with the variety of products on the market is a shift in the type of consumption that people are interested in. So when we look at current consumers, we still see the majority of them smoke as their primary method of consumption. You know, upwards of 60 percent say that smoking cannabis is the way they most often consume. Even though you're seeing more frequently people choosing more than just non smoke, or more than just smoke methods of cannabis. Um, sorry about that. Um, So you see more, uh, non smoked, uh, methods of cannabis consumption being deployed. But something that's really interesting is that when we talk to potential consumers, people that haven't yet consumed cannabis but are open to it, They say it's over 70 percent of them say they would choose non smoked methods.

Now, that [00:02:00] shouldn't really surprise anyone. We look at cigarette smoking has been on the decline for some, some time. Um, smoking is not allowed in most places. It's smelly. It's very obvious that you're doing it. Most people are looking for a more discreet method of consumption. So they are way more likely to want to pop a gummy, uh, while sitting at a concert than worrying about lighting up a joint and who's going to smell it.

So I think One of the biggest differences we've seen is a move towards non smoked methods of consumption. Uh, we've also seen, uh, a sophistication emerge among consumers. You know, a lot of times in prohibition days, we didn't really have the vocabulary to talk about what we were looking for. You know, we wanted cannabis, we knew that, but in terms of getting into the different terpene profiles, the different potency levels, the different effects that you may get by adding minor cannabinoids like CBN to a product, we We're starting to see a better vocabulary of consumers in terms of what they're looking for and what they expect to happen in terms of effect.

We are way beyond [00:03:00] Indica and Sativa as the primary indicators of what to expect. And so I think a sophistication has come along with that as well. And then of course consumer demographics are changing. Now part of that is because, let's face it, old people always used cannabis, parents always used cannabis, but they may have been more reluctant to admit. Their cannabis consumption because of the stigma and because of the real legal ramifications of being a parent or a caregiver and using an illicit substance. So, we're definitely seeing certain age groups increase, uh, in terms of consumption. Uh, people that are in their late 30s, mid 40s, we're seeing big increases there.

We're seeing big increases among consumers 65 and over. And so, I think that there's kind of a rediscovery of cannabis among people who weren't using it because it was illegal, and a higher willingness to admit that, yes, I am indeed a cannabis consumer, um, among people that may be parents or people that are actively employed.

Tommy: That's so [00:04:00] interesting in terms of the different consumer trends in emerging and existing. So let's say, let's say I'm in an emerging market like New York. That has a very strong legacy presence. What would your advice be to legal retailers on how to compete with the gray market? I

Amanda: And I, if I had the answer to that question, Tommy, I would probably be a very highly paid individual. Um, because, you know, we've seen a lot of legal markets come on in the last 15 years or so. Really the only markets that have had a huge difficult time converting gray market consumers are California and New York. And this is because, like you mentioned, they have a very entrenched, effective, and efficient, uh, So the question becomes, how do I convince a consumer who's been using the unregulated market for a long time that now they should use this other market? And oh, it's going to cost you more money and oh, you're going to have to go into this retail environment when someone usually just came and [00:05:00] delivered it to your house. And that's a really good question. I do think that the opportunity to purchase. Tested and regulated edible products and manufactured products is a pull into the regulated market, you know, let's face it, the pot brownies that you were offered at a party aren't going to be as, um, as, as easily dosable and, uh, you're not really going to know what to expect from that effect than like the nice packaged gummy where each one has 10 milligrams of THC.

So I think that's definitely a pull leaning into your manufactured product opportunities and availability and really pulling in legacy market consumers with that. I think you're going to have to understand the prices. So what prices is the shop down the street that isn't licensed? What are they offering?

And obviously people in the regulated market need to make money and the margins are already super slim because of compliance costs. But if you understand that a product very similar to your own is being sold down the street for half the price, you may [00:06:00] not be able to go to half the price, but you're going to have to understand what it might take to pull that consumer over. And so really knowing who that gray market consumer is, and we did a report on that last year at New Frontier. Where we analyze differences between regulated market consumers and gray market consumers. And this may surprise you, it may not. I'm a Gen Xer, so this didn't surprise me. When we look at who the gray market consumers are, they're Gen X men who smoke. That's who that is, right? So it's people that use a lot of cannabis. It's people that already have a reliable source in the gray market, and people that do not want to pay the prices associated with the regulated market. Like, this is who's still going to be in that legacy market. Now, is that going to change as they get older?

Maybe they've been smoking for a long time, they start to notice some negative health effects, they're looking for a different type of product. Maybe, I think that the invention of nano emulsified edibles actually plays into this a lot [00:07:00] because one of the bigger barriers for adoption of edibles was time of onset and people having to wait two hours in order to feel the effect. Now you have the opportunity for people to feel those effects in 15 minutes. This is going to act a lot more like an inhalable and I think you're going to pull some people away from smoking into that market because of things like nano emulsification. So, I think a lot of it depends on what the regulated market chooses to hold up as kind of the reason to come over.

And right now, I think it's manufactured products. I think it's understanding the price points in the unregulated market. And I think that testing, I mean, let's face it, a lot of people think, well, I've been buying weed on the unregulated market for 20 years. I never got sick. Nothing bad happened to me, but I think as we ramp up commercial production, we are gonna see some of the same risks in that product that we do in industrialized agriculture, for example.

Like yesterday, like every supermarket recalled a ton of meat, uh, because of contamination. So I do [00:08:00] think we're gonna start to question the safety of products, especially those on the unregulated market, and that may also drive some people over.

Tommy: love that you mentioned nano emulsification because I was listening to one of your podcasts and you mentioned that I have a Turbulent history with edibles, because my body just

can't

Amanda: a good way to put

it. Turbulent. I like that. That hits the nail right on the head there.

Tommy: and I, I never knew about nano emulsification until you spoke about it. Can you talk a little bit more about, uh, I guess this new technology and also how, how much education is required to, as a retailer, to turn on your, What

Amanda: question. And I think there's two things. There's the science. And then there's what do consumers need to know to understand the value of this product. So first I'll go into the science. So [00:09:00] tech, uh, traditionally when you eat an edible, when you ingest cannabis orally, meaning that you eat it as a food, it has to be processed through the liver in order for it to get into your bloodstream.

And that process, not only does it take a few hours in order to complete, but it actually transforms the Delta 9 THC in that cannabis to Delta 11 THC. Which is literally, I wouldn't say it's as simple as two more, but it's a stronger version of THC than what we're used to from inhalation. And so when people use edibles, not only is there a bit of a question about when they're going to feel it and how they're going to feel it. But when they do feel it, it's a stronger effect, meaning that it reads more like a psychedelic in a lot of people than it does like smoking a joint. There's also a different dose response relationship, so I'm going to use my really high tech hand to show you. Um, when you smoke, you feel it right away. that that increase and in effect. But then it wears off fairly quickly. Usually within 20 minutes or so, you [00:10:00] start to come down. When you eat a traditional edible, because of that transformation that's happening in the liver, the onset is much slower. And then once you reach that peak intoxication, you're there. For like a while. And for some folks, once you start getting into that second hour of intoxication, they don't like it as much anymore. And they start to feel overwhelmed. They start to feel anxious. They start to feel panicky. Their friend is like, Oh man, you're going to be high for five days. And like, that doesn't help anything. And so I think traditionally, because of that, edible adoption has been a barrier for a lot of people. Now, with nanoemulsification, what it's basically doing is it's breaking down that THC so small that it is absorbed into the bloodstream immediately without having to pass through the liver. And so what that does is a couple things.

One, it makes it so you're going to feel the effect in like 15 minutes or so. Secondly, that [00:11:00] effect is going to be Delta 9 THC. It's not going to be that Delta 11. So the effect itself is going to mimic more what people expect to feel via inhalation. So it's a more familiar high, it's a more comfortable high, it's not as intense, it doesn't last as long.

And so folks are able to kind of keep what they like about smoking, which is the fast onset. And the tolerable high that is not so sustained, but not have to smoke in order to do it. So that's the science. I think the second part of what I just said, the last part, that's the marketing. Right? So it's addressing the fact that the unpredictability of edibles and the intense effect of edibles is what turns a lot of people off to them. And nano emulsification gets over these hurdles. So it's take an edible, feel it in 15 minutes. Don't like the high? Don't worry, you're going to be down in less than an hour. Edible's too intense for you, this is a high that feels more like smoking. And I think that's what consumers need [00:12:00] to know when making these decisions.

And one of the things that's really interesting is that this nanotechnology really came to bear first in, in beverages. Um, and so when people are looking for a substitute for alcohol, nano emulsified beverages are really great because if you're hanging out with your friends and they're drinking beer and you're drinking a traditional edible or eating a traditional edible.

They're on their like third beer before you feel anything. And so there was a real mismatch in terms of onset time. But if you're drinking a nano emulsified beverage and your friend is drinking a beer, you're actually going to be kind of toe to toe with them in terms of effect. And the length of effect.

And so I think it makes a much more suitable alcohol substitute than a traditional edible. And, and that I think is one of the best uses for cannabis edibles, especially beverages is for people to have an alternative to alcohol.

Tommy: You guys have such a rich history in data and helping retailers leverage data to attract more [00:13:00] customers. How can a retailer leverage data to attract more customers or increase basket size?

Amanda: Well for one, it's understanding who your customers are. Right. So who's your target consumer? Who buys your products? Uh, I think this goes without saying every company out there should understand who their consumer is. Who's coming through the door? What do we know about them? What demographic do they represent?

What cannabis archetype? You know, New Frontier Data has these cannabis archetypes. So are they a contemporary lifestyler? Are they a savvy connoisseur? Um, are they a holistic healer? Are they a modern medicinal? You know, all of these folks are different demographically, but they're also different in intention.

So if you want to market a product to someone, you have to understand why they're using cannabis. Are they using it as a medical product? Are they using it to help at the end of the day when they're stressed out from work? Are they using it to enhance a festival experience? Are they using it to treat a pain condition? Because in order to get that customer to [00:14:00] buy your product, you have to understand why they want to use a product and then you have to message to them how your product is going to fit that need, right? So I think that's really the first step is who is your consumer? Why are they choosing cannabis and how can you talk about your product to them in a way that's going to really meet their need? I think a second piece that a lot of retailers don't do, which New Frontier is, I think, pretty good at, I'll say really good at. Who isn't buying your product but should? Right? So a lot of times with cannabis, it's like one of those dark rooms where you're shining the flashlight on one spot and you're focusing on what's in that one spot and trying to make the most of what's in that one spot. We encourage people to turn the lights on in the room and see who isn't part of that spot but should be. Right? So if you have a product that's really great for sleep, for example, you may understand who's buying your product. But who isn't buying your product that also needs [00:15:00] help with sleep? And where are they?

And what do they care about? And how do you reach them? What publications are they reading? Where do they go during the day? What, how do they, how do you reach them on social media? What causes do they care about? And so New Frontier takes an approach where Yes, we're going to help you reach the 35 year old woman who's using cannabis to help with sleep.

Like, we can help you target that consumer. But what about all the other women out there, or all the other people out there that also may need help with sleep, that aren't using cannabis yet? Or maybe they're using cannabis, but they're using a different brand and it's not meeting their need. Or maybe they're using a different brand and it is meeting their need, but your product offers something unique and special. So I think that there is a piece of customer segmentation that reaches beyond who is already your ideal consumer, and then goes into who should be your ideal consumer, but you're just not reaching them yet. So I think that that's one [00:16:00] strategy. When it comes to increasing basket size, I mean, there's only so much you can do there, right?

So, as long as they're buying your product. Then that's good. Now, if you're a retailer and you're like, well, I want them to buy more products, it's thinking about how certain products hold together and how you can do cross promotional marketing. So a good example of this is we worked with Bic, the lighter company, uh, for a couple of years, helping them better understand the cannabis market. And you know, they, you can buy lighters and a lot of dispensaries. A lot of those lighters are Bic lighters. But what we did is we did a basket analysis. And we said, okay, when people buy Bic lighters, they're buying pre rolls. Like that's why they're buying a lighter. They're buying a lighter because they either bought a pre roll or the dispensary gave them a pre roll.

They realize they don't have a lighter and they want to use that pre roll before they get home. We also found that men were more likely to buy lighters than women. And we were like, well, women have purses. They're more likely to [00:17:00] already have a lighter on them because they carry around a satchel with their needs.

A man doesn't have that. So unless he has a lighter in his coat pocket or in his jeans pocket, he's likely going to need to buy one in order to use a pre roll. Then we told them these are the top brands of pre rolls that people have in their basket. when they're buying a Bic lighter. So there's all kinds of marketing opportunities from what I just told you, right?

You could reach out to those companies and say, Hey, let's do a promotion where when they buy one of yours, they get one of ours for free. It's a good, you know, marketing tool. Um, let's target men and let's use a marketing campaign with, did you go to the dispensary and forget a lighter? Uh, let's look at dispensaries that sell the most pre rolls. And go after them to make sure that they have BICs front and center for people that buy pre rolls. So, I think part of it is understanding what's the relationship between your product and other products that are being sold at a dispensary, and how can you bundle those things together so that [00:18:00] when people are buying one, they're likely to buy the other as well.

Tommy: That is so insightful. I would have never thought about the connection between pre world worlds and lighters and then men and lighters.

Amanda: Oh, yeah. I mean, we're always looking for a lighter, right? And if you get offered a discounted pre roll at a dispensary, and it's like a free gift, and you're like, Oh, yeah, man, I'm going to stop. It's a beautiful day. I'm going to go smoke this. And then you realize you don't have a lighter. Bam, right?

There's the opportunity for lighter purchases. We found that most lighters that are sold are white labeled, meaning that dispensaries and brands are using them in order to market. So Reach out to those top pre roll companies that are being paired with BIC and see about white label opportunities. So again, data can really help you identify your customer, what they want, who isn't your customer, but should be, and how products can be packaged together in order to increase the overall sale to an individual.

Tommy: If I was [00:19:00] a retail store, uh, if I was just a retailer today, and I am now thinking to myself, how can I leverage data to. Increase the scope or increase the visibility of the product that I serve. Where would, where would you start? Or, you know, what recommendations would you have for me?

Amanda: Well, the first thing I would do is I would figure out, What are the demographics of people that have sleep issues? And there's a lot of research out there in academic journals about sleep problems, and who does it most affect, right? And so one population that just comes to mind because I represent that population are middle aged women. So middle aged women, we start to go through perimenopause, which leads to menopause. One of the symptoms of that is sleep disturbance, right? So I would think, okay, here you have a whole group of women who are of a certain age, Who may not use cannabis, but maybe they're experiencing sleep issues. Where are they going for information?

And I would look to health [00:20:00] organizations and practitioners that specifically help women with menopause. There's menopause coaches out there that women meet with to help figure out how to manage the symptoms of menopause. And I would reach out to them, and I would offer to do an education demonstration. To their client cohort, um, if it's an organization, I would offer to write a blog, uh, for their organization about how cannabis can be used for sleep. Now, you could say this is paid marketing, and of course you'd want your name of your company associated with the blog, but I would not make it a marketing style blog.

I would make it very science based. We have a lot of research on cannabis and sleep. Why does it help with sleep? What is CBN? How do people use it? What product form is best for sleep? So I would leverage that data to educate. And through education, you're going to get people that say, Oh, you know, I never thought of cannabis for sleep before.

Or, you know, I've seen these products, but I've been afraid to try them. So it's really like the top of the [00:21:00] funnel. Who is educating and helping this population that we know from research. is, uh, experiencing this issue, and how do we educate the top of the funnel on cannabis as a potential solution for this issue, so that it trickles down to their membership and to the people that they help. You know, one of the biggest barriers to medical cannabis adoption is that the doctors themselves know very little about medical cannabis. They're not taught about it in school. It's not part of their continuing medical education. And so a lot of times, it's kind of up to us. the people that have the data, that have the information to be the educators and to say, you know, you are responsible for helping a population that suffers from this issue. We have data on how these types of products can help people with that issue. Can I do some education? And I think that that's a really good way to kind of bring the information to a population, but in a way that [00:22:00] isn't salesy the way where they don't feel like it's an infomercial. Okay. But where you're really trying to impart the information they need in order to make more educated decisions.

You know, dispensaries used to have, and some of them still do, a lot of educational content. So, you know, they would say, come to the dispensary on Sunday afternoon, we're going to have a nurse talking all about using cannabis for sleep or using cannabis during menopause and we're going to have free samples and we're going to have a light lunch and we're going to have, you know, some, some activities, some yoga available. I think the more you do that, that's really what's going to get people to take the chance. So, I'm going to talk to you a little bit about cannabis and how it's affecting people's lives, rather than just seeing an ad coming to them on social media and deciding to take the plunge. cannabis has been stigmatized for decades, so we can't expect people to just adopt it the way they may adopt a vitamin or another treatment, we have to do the work. And that starts with understanding who the population is, what the barriers to adoption may be, and then filling that [00:23:00] need with information.

Tommy: Where do you think, and I know that the cannabis beverage industry is in its infancy, where do you think the industry is headed?

Amanda: Well, I'd like, I said I'd like to see it with parity to alcohol. So like if I could just wave my magic cannabis wand and believe me there's at least three times a day I wish I had a magic cannabis wand, I would like to see other states adopt the Minnesota model and not just for hemp beverages. Like, I do think that when we're talking about potency levels. under 10 milligrams that we should not necessarily keep these products only at dispensaries. I mean, you know, when we go to the grocery store, I can buy enough alcohol to kill me at the grocery store and I just have to show that I'm over 21 in order to access it, right? So I, I do think that there is a place for dispensaries, especially when it comes to flour and maybe products like.

concentrates that are a little bit more potent and we want to [00:24:00] make sure that like people are getting some education around them. Um, but when it comes to low dose products, and including beverages, like I would love to be able to go into my local pub and either order a beer or order a five milligram cannabis beverage.

Uh, I, I do think that's the future. If we really want to see, like I said, the opportunity to substitute cannabis beverages for alcohol. We have to make them as easy to access as alcohol.

Tommy: Which takes me to my next topic, consumption lounges.

Amanda: Yes.

Tommy: Where are consumption lounges today in certain states and what do you think the potential is for consumption lounges in the future?

Amanda: Well, that's a great question. I think similarly to hemp, each state is kind of taking a different approach. Um, you know, you have some states that don't have any social consumption at all. You have some states that allow consumption lounges to be annexed onto dispensaries. So if you have a license for a dispensary, you [00:25:00] can have a space in the dispensary that allows people to consume.

Um, Sometimes smoking is allowed, sometimes smoking isn't allowed. A lot of times that's left to individual localities to decide how they want to regulate that. And then you have what California is doing, which is separate consumption lounges that are not necessarily attached to a dispensary where you can have things like non infused food and drink available, uh, where you can have entertainment available, where you, uh, an event. can get a special permit that allows people to consume onsite in an event. So, um, I'm part of the advisory board for the California State Fairs cannabis Exhibit. And this past summer for the first time, it's been around for three years, but this summer was the first time that they were able to get a permit for onsite sales and consumption.

So you could actually buy cannabis onsite. They had a consumption area where you could use cannabis onsite. And so I think we are moving in the direction of. So, at least considering whether social consumption is something that can be integrated [00:26:00] into legalization. Now, the history of social consumption was really born out of community need.

And you know, I could go and give a long drawn out history of medical cannabis, but the short version is that, you know, medical cannabis really came to us from the HIV AIDS community in San Francisco in the late 1980s, early 1990s. We're a lot of folks from that community were using cannabis in order to quell a lot of mental health and physical health symptoms associated with having HIV. It was also a time when a lot of confusion and lies about how HIV was contracted was bringing these folks into social isolation. They weren't allowed to interact with their friends, their family. Because there was concerns about getting and catching HIV, which of course now we know is total bull. And so in the absence of that, these communities formed their own ways to And that was really what the first dispensaries were.

There were places where people from the HIV community could come and not only access their [00:27:00] medicine, but use it with each other and have this sense of community, and not feel so isolated, and talk to each other about their health and their well being, and have some camaraderie and some sense of community. Also, cannabis was illegal, so if, especially if I was in a rented apartment, or if I was in federal housing, I couldn't just go consume my medicine in my living room, because I was running the real risk of getting kicked out of my housing, and this was something that did happen. It wasn't necessarily safe for me to go and use my medicine sitting in my car in a parking lot or sitting in a public park somewhere.

And So consumption lounges really served the purpose of allowing people that didn't have, a lot of choice about where to consume a safe place to do so. And I think they still serve that purpose today. There's still risk of people in federal housing getting their housing taken away if they are consuming cannabis.

There's still the risk if I have a landlord of them telling me there's no smoking allowed in the building. Uh, there's still a safety risk of consuming out in [00:28:00] public. And so I think consumption lounges really have the same purpose as they did back then. I think another important point about consumption lounges is that there's a safety aspect and a harm reduction aspect.

You know, one of the reasons we have bars is because we don't want people wandering around drunk in the streets. Uh, we want people to be served alcohol and those servers to go through some kind of safe server training so that they can learn what someone who's too drunk looks like, what to do if somebody overdoses at the bar, what to do if there's an altercation because people are intoxicated.

You know, these all present as safety measures. So similarly with cannabis. We'd want people serving people at consumption lounges to understand dosing, to understand what overconsumption looks like, what to do if somebody has consumed too much, uh, to be able to offer them non infused food and drink so that they can mitigate some of the effects of being overconsumed. Um, and these all happen in consumption lounges. [00:29:00] So I do think they play a very important community role. Um, I do think they're important. But again, they're not without risk, right? We don't want people consuming a lot and getting in their cars. We don't want people who work in consumption lounges to be exposed to cannabis smoke for six to eight hours a day. So these are discussions we have to have. How do we keep people safe? How do we maximize the benefits of these facilities while minimizing the risk?

Tommy: Yeah, there's still so much to be solved.

I think you hit the nail on the head. It's still smoke.

Amanda: it's still smoke, and you know, I have been fortunate enough to be a consultant on a lot of research projects. Some of those were done through the Tobacco Research Center at University of California, San Francisco. And you know, I'm a scientist, so I believe the data. No matter what my heart wants to believe, I'm going to believe what the data say.

And unfortunately, the data do say that there is some health risk. exposure [00:30:00] to cannabis smoke. And this is dose response. So the more you're exposed to it, the more risk there is. It doesn't mean that we should ban smoking, um, but it does mean that if we're going to allow smoking in an enclosed space, we want to make sure the air purification is adequate. We want to make sure that workers have minimal exposure over time to that. I mean, Hey, I worked the Emerald Cup for years, um, inside one of the large facilities that they have where they allow consumption. And these are not small rooms. These are like big warehouses. And after being in those spaces for like five hours working, I would feel terrible. You know, I, my lungs would hurt. I have my nose would be stuffy. I would feel high. Even if I hadn't consumed. So, these are things we have to take into account if we want to make sure that everybody can enjoy these spaces but still stay safe.

Tommy: I know that I don't have you much longer and I want to talk a little bit about New Frontier Data. I'm a huge believer [00:31:00] in, as an entrepreneur, to doing everything possible to give you the competitive edge. Can you talk a little bit about how New Frontier Data helped retailers, particularly increased sales?

Amanda: Uh, well, as I mentioned, it's all about understanding who's coming into your dispensary and who looks just like them but isn't coming into your dispensary. And in order to do that, we leverage several different forms of data. So, first we do attribution. So, we're going to be able to place pixels. In your website, on your thank you page, on your menu page.

And then we're going to be able to tell you how many people are accessing these pages and who they are, um, so that you can make better decisions about media spend. So, you know, you can place a banner ad in multiple places, which one's performing the best, who is it bringing onto your page, and then we're able to tell you whether that person ends up ordering from you or walking into your dispensary or not. And so to do this, we utilize not only mobile ID data, but foot traffic data. So we [00:32:00] can tell you, okay, so Tommy viewed this, uh, ad, and then two days later, he walked into your dispensary. So we can help you understand how the impact of your advertising is bringing people into your dispensary or we can tell you, Hey, Tommy viewed this ad and then the next day he went onto your menu and he put items in his cart and he bought something from you and then he went and picked it up at the dispensary. But that's only part of the equation. Well, we can also tell you is who's out there that looks just like Tommy, but isn't coming into your dispensary and what are they doing and where are they going? So we use foot traffic data for this. So we can tell, you know, people who look like Tommy, they like to go to the pizza place in the afternoon and on Saturdays they like to go to this type of store.

And then you can think about how do you leverage that data in order to place ads in places where people who do those activities are looking or spending time. We also have a database of millions of people who are likely [00:33:00] cannabis consumers, meaning they've either

been to a dispensary in the last six months or so, or they look like people who have been to dispensaries in the last six months or so.

And we have a ton of information about who these people are, where they get their information, So what kind of social media channels they use. who they donate money to what their political affiliation is, um, what type of, of, of publications they read and subscribe to, um, what type of places they live, what type of places they work.

And so we can help you develop consumer segmented profiles. who are people that should be coming

into your dispensary because they look just like your customers, but they're not. and then we can do targeted ads to them as well. So this is all about figuring out again, who's coming in but maybe even more importantly, who looks just like, those people, but who isn't coming in.

Where are they spending their time? what do they care about,

And how can we use media strategy in order to put your brand or your [00:34:00] dispensary in front of their eyes? So, that is kind of a little bit about how our methodology works. The product that we have that delivers all of this is called NextTech. And so what we do is we meet with the dispensary and we

immediately start mapping who's coming into your dispensary.

We immediately develop media strategy, we place our pixels, we can tell you how our media strategy is impacting foot traffic either into a physical brick and mortar store or into online shopping. And then we can do lookalike modeling and say, okay, this is the type of person who loves your dispensary, who loves your products.

Let's see what else we can tell about them. And who we can target that isn't yet a customer, but should be.

Tommy: Do you, and you probably have a lot of data in terms of dispensaries that are not leveraging data as well as media buying or, the work that you guys do versus afterwards.

Amanda: Oh, absolutely. So I [00:35:00] mentioned we have these consumer archetypes. Right? So, even above and beyond the media buying and the attribution data and the foot traffic data, if you tell us we're trying to target this type of consumer, we can look at our archetypes and say, okay, that type of consumer uses this type of product for this reason, they're this age, they're this gender, and this is how much they spend.

And then we can go to our database of likely consumers. And we can pull tens of thousands of people that match this profile. And then we can do targeted marketing to them. So you can kind of reverse engineer it, where it's not, Okay, who's already coming in? It's, who do I want to come in? Who is the target market for this new product I'm releasing or this new product we're carrying at the dispensary?

We can then do lookalike modeling to find those people and then market to them. So you can either look at what's working and then go out and try to get more of those people, or you can look at who you [00:36:00] want to get and we can help you find out where they are and what messaging speaks to them.

Tommy: This is, it's, there's so much more of a tie to ROI versus, uh, the traditional PR type of, uh, avenues that dispensaries do.

Amanda: Oh, absolutely. I mean, you can decide to put out a press release or decide to put out an ad and then loosely connect that to whether you saw your revenue increase. And maybe you can get data on like the number of people that viewed your ad, but we're able to tell you Tommy viewed your ad. And then Tommy bought a product from you, or Tommy viewed your ad and then Tommy came into your dispensary. And I think that that is really useful because it's going to help you understand who is being most affected by the media and are you affecting the right person. So you may say, well, yeah, that's great, but Tommy buys like one pre roll a month. Like, he's not the person we want. We want the person that's going to come in and buy an ounce every month. And so we can [00:37:00] look at buying habits and we can say, well, Tommy's this type of consumer and what you really want is this type of consumer. Let's go find some of those people and let's do targeted marketing at them.

Tommy: Wonderful. That's so awesome. I am such a big fan. I stumbled across My Personal Plants, by the way, looking you up and preparing to talk to you. Can you talk a little bit about My Personal Plants?

Amanda: Absolutely. So that's my like labor of love. Um, so, you know, being in this space for so long as an activist, um, I have definitely observed the two sides of the cannabis coin. Uh, all during Prohibition when we were trying to legalize, you had one group out there that was, cannabis is terrible, never legalize it, it's gonna cause the downfall of society, it causes all of these harms. And then you had the other side, which was, cannabis is risk free, it's not addictive, you can't overdose, it's the safest thing in the world, we should regulate it like tomatoes, cannabis for everyone all the time. And [00:38:00] those are really the two sides for a very long time. And now that we have a legal market, I felt like there was a need to kind of walk the middle line. And if we're gonna help people have long term healthy relationships with cannabis, which, let's face it, we're never taught how to do that in school, in health education. You know, we're never taught what a healthy relationship with cannabis looks like. We're just taught not to do it. I decided to start My Personal Plants as a way to provide very accessible, science backed information to consumers. who wanted to learn what a healthy relationship with cannabis looks like, who wanted to understand what is moderation, what is mindful consumption, what are the risks of using cannabis, but in a realistic way, right? Because cannabis has a lot of benefits, but it's not without risk. And I wrote an article a few weeks ago, um, comparing cannabis to exercise. Because a lot of times we compare cannabis to alcohol and I [00:39:00] get why we do that. They're both intoxicating substances that are widely used in society. I get it. But I think cannabis and exercise are much better comparisons because both

of them are inherently healthy activities. cannabis is an inherently healthy plant for you and exercise is an inherently healthy practice.

However, Just like You can misuse cannabis and use it, too much and use the wrong product for you and what your needs are, you can also do the same thing with exercise. So you can exercise too much to the point where you hurt yourself. You can exercise in a way that's putting your body at risk. Your doctor can say, I don't want you to lift weights for a month because you hurt your shoulder and you can do it anyway.

And reinjure your shoulder or make it take longer to heal. And so just because exercise is an inherently healthy practice doesn't mean you can't injure yourself or put yourself at risk by not

being mindful and [00:40:00] smart about it. And I feel the same way about cannabis. cannabis is an inherently healthy.

But if you don't learn about how to use the right product for you, if you don't learn about what risks it may pose to you specifically using cannabis based on your family history, your personal history, your current health and mental state, you could hurt yourself. You could use cannabis in a

way that increases risk and harm.

And so I wanted personal plants to be a source of truth. for people that didn't want to hear that it was horrible and didn't want to hear that it was wonderful, but wanted to kind of cut through that and say, okay, how do I use this product in a way that's going to increase the chance of me getting the benefits from it and decrease the chance of me getting harmed by it? And so I post articles that help people understand that. I have a web series called the truth about the plant that are 15 minutes long. So super easy to watch and answer questions [00:41:00] like Is THC addictive? Can you overdose on cannabis? How are hemp derived products made? Uh, we had one last week on are Indica and Sativa real? Um, so that consumers can make better choices about their health and their cannabis consumption.

Tommy: I think it's great content for sales associates in our industry as well.

Amanda: And it's also good for bud tenders, you know, uh, folks who want to learn how to talk about cannabis. You know, we spend so much time pushing certain products because they're on sale, or we want to get them off the shelves. Um, but there's a nuanced conversation to be had, and it isn't necessarily pushing people towards the most potent products. Um, there's a lot that we should be doing about helping people with moderation, and understanding that high THC percentage does not in any way equate to having the best time.

Tommy: Yeah, I, I think there's, I think you can increase sales while educating consumers on what, what they should really [00:42:00] think about buying based on what they, how they want to feel.

Amanda: Oh, a hundred percent. I mean, if you have somebody that's new to cannabis and they buy an edible that is too strong for them and they have a horrible experience, guess what? They're never coming back. And that, that's someone that could have developed a very healthy and beneficial relationship with cannabis who now is against it because of that experience. But if we help people have good experiences, they're going to keep coming back. And from a public health perspective, that's good because they may be using cannabis instead of a pharmaceutical drug or instead of alcohol. From a sales perspective, that's also good because now you have a customer who trusts you and trusts your recommendations and is going to want to explore more about how cannabis may be beneficial to them.

Tommy: Amanda, thank you so much for joining us today. Where can our listeners find you?

Amanda: Well, uh, you can find New Frontier at newfrontierdata. com. Uh, you can find Personal Plants at mypersonalplants. com. Uh, [00:43:00] Personal Plants is also on all the social medias. And then you can find me on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, just with my name. On Instagram, I'm Dr. Amanda Ryman. Everywhere else, I'm just Amanda Ryman.

Um, and so I like to post a lot of content, uh, myself as well.

Tommy: We will drop your links in, in the pod. Thank you so much for joining.

Amanda: My pleasure. Thank you for having me.

Tommy: I hope you guys enjoyed that conversation as always, please like, subscribe, it really helps to channel out a lot. Till next time guys take care.

Outro: Thanks for listening to the KayaCast podcast. We hope you enjoyed the show. Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast and your favorite podcast app, or visit our website to access the full archive of episodes from the show.

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